Lessons on the Upanishads -2.7: Swami Krishnananda.

===================================================================================

Monday 02, Sep 2024. 07:10.
Upanishads
Chapter 2: The Problem in Understanding the Upanishads - 7.
Post-15.

===================================================================================

 What is the great thing that I am going to gain out of it?” Terrible is the problem. If you have answers and questions of this kind and you have doubts as to why this Self is to be considered as so important, you will not be immediately fit for the knowledge of the Upanishads. People had to stay with the Guru for many years.

I will tell you another story. One day Prajapati, the Creator, announced: “He who knows the Self knows all things.”

Both the gods and the demons heard this and said, “Oh! Is it so? If one knows the Self, all things are known? Then it is worth knowing. Let us go.”

“Great Master, we have come to learn the Self from you which—as you proclaimed—is the source of all knowledge.” The gods sent Indra as their representative to obtain this wisdom. The demons sent Virochana as their leader. Both of them went to Prajapati and said, “We have come for Knowledge.”

“Stay here and observe discipline for many years,” replied Prajapati.

 They stayed with Prajapati and served him for years and years—thirty-two years. After the lapse of so many years of discipline and hardship under the tutelage of Prajapati, these two persons approached him and said: “Now, please initiate us into the nature of the Self.”

“Come on,” Prajapati replied. “Go and look at yourself in a pan of water, a vessel filled with water. You will see something there. That is the Self.”

“Oh, good; very good. It is a very simple matter,” they said.

They looked. What did they see? They saw their own face—their own body.

Virochana said, “Now I know what is the Self. This body is the Self.”

Virochana returned home and proclaimed to all the demons: “Now we know what the Self is, by knowing which all things are known and all things can be obtained. This very body is the Self. Eat, drink, be merry and enjoy.”

Thus it is that the philosophy of enjoyment, hedonism and materialism started with Virochana, because he concluded that the Ultimate Reality is this body, which was very clear from the instructions he received from Prajapati. And what does this body need? It needs eating, drinking, enjoying, sleeping and all the appurtenances of physicality.

Indra also got this knowledge. He left, thinking that he had this wisdom. On the way, he had a difficulty.

“Is this the Self? This thing? No, it cannot be. The Self is supposed to be a permanent entity, but this body is not permanent. So if the body gets old, the Self will also become old; if the body become sick, the Self will also become sick; if the body dies, the Self will also die. No, no, there is something wrong in this,” he thought.

Indra went to Prajapati again. Virochana did not come back; he was happy. But Indra came back.

“How is it that you have come back?” asked Prajapati.

“Sir, there is some problem. I see no good in this instruction.”

“What is the matter?”

“If this body falls sick, the Self will also fall sick. If the body dies, the Self will also die. Is this the Self?” asked Indra.

“Stay here another thirty-two years,” Prajapati said.

“Okay, I will stay,” replied Indra.

After thirty-two years, Indra went to Prajapati a second time and requested, “Please instruct me.”

“What you see in dream is the Self,” said Prajapati.

“Oh, I see; okay, good,” said Indra.

Indra left, but on the way he again had a problem: “Dream? What do I see in dream? I see in dream whatever I see in waking—the same thing. There is hunger and thirst. There is old age and decrepitude. There is even death in dream. All the difficulties and pains of life are capable of being experienced in dream also. The dream self also dies. No, this is no good.”

Indra again came back.

“Why have you come again?” asked Prajapati.

“There is some problem, sir,” replied Indra. “The dream self is fickle. It seems to be dying, just like the waking self about which you told me. I see no good in this instruction. Please give the correct instruction.”

“Stay another thirty-two years,” said Prajapati.

Indra stayed another thirty-two years, and then Prajapati told him, “What you see in the state of deep sleep, that is the Self.”

“Good” Indra said, and went away.

On the way, again a doubt arose. “What do I see in deep sleep? Nothing. It is like a negation of all things—darkness; it is veritable death. Is this the Self? No, this is no good,” thought Indra. Again he went back.

“Oh, how are you here again?” asked Prajapati.

 “Sir, this instruction is of no use. What do I see in deep sleep? I see complete darkness, negation, annihilation. So, is the Self an annihilation? No, I don't see good in this instruction; please give me proper instruction.”

“Oh, I see. Stay again and undergo discipline here,” said Prajapati. This time it was for five years. Prajapati was a little considerate.

When Indra came back after five years, Prajapati said: “Now listen, Indra, my dear one. This Self is not what you can see with your eyes, because it is the Seer of things. How can you see it? This body is the seen; it is an object like any other object in this world. If the Ultimate Self, which is the Supreme Reality, is not an object that is perishable, it cannot be the body either. Otherwise, the Self will die along with the death of the body. What good is this knowledge of the Self? The Self is not what is seen in dream because in dream there is such fluctuation, fickleness of thought and veritable transition, transitoriness, and all the sorrows that are incumbent in the waking life. The waking perception also is not the Self. The dream, the waking are both not the Self. The sleeping experience also is not the Self. What you experience in the state of deep sleep is not the Self; it is a negation of it.”

========================================================================================

Continued

========================================================================================